P&C does it again!

bluecow

Active member
#22
Why would you file a claim on a 1oz bulk backy loss?
A couple months back came out of a discount store thinking that what I payed didn't add up to what I got. Looked over the receipt and found that the clerk didn't ring in one item, about $10. So back into the store with receipt and the item and had them charge me another $10. IT WAS THE RIGHT THING TO DO! I work hard for ever GD penny I earn. I treat others fairly and I not only expect but demand that they do the same with me. GOOD FOR YOU KRIS1979
 

Marker

Well-known member
#23
Whomever is responsible for managing the internet sales system/software for that whole family of online shops does a horrendous job.
Very true, but I think it is an organizational thing. Ten years ago this wasn't the case. You called you talked to a rep that you knew the face of, from the website or mailers or something. Now you can't call or email or anything to get a real live person without supreme effort and luck. They just don't want to put personnel or effort into it.
 

cigrmaster

Well-known member
#24
Cigars International has sucked since they opened. When they took over PC, they ruined the company. I used to buy tons of tins from them as their prices ordering 5 or more tins of the same blend was cheaper than ordering 20 of the same blend at SP. I spent a ton there and when CI took over they ditched my entire order system with no notice and I lost all my history.
Their inventory went to carp as soon as CI took over. They had no clue what was popular, totally useless buyer.
 
#27
Ahhh yes, another P&C bashing thread, who's the booky with whom we register bets on how many pages it will go before the mods shut it down, these can get pretty epic
It will just move to another forum or to Facebook. Odd thing about this thread is that I can’t for the life of me figure out what injury the OP suffered because they requested damaged packaging from months back. Most tiresome subject ever.
 

SmokeRings

Well-known member
Patron
#28
It will just move to another forum or to Facebook. Odd thing about this thread is that I can’t for the life of me figure out what injury the OP suffered because they requested damaged packaging from months back. Most tiresome subject ever.
I generally agree that I see little point in beating a dead horse, but I also acknowledge that our members are perfectly welcome to post whatever they would like within the established rules of the forum, so I really haven't got a dog in the fight, I have had both good and bad orders from P&C, I prefer to use other etailers when I can, but occasionally they are the only ones who stock a given product and I know good and well what I'm getting myself into and that those who play with fire long enough are going to get burned, I just chalk it up to the price to play the game.
 

Sasquatch

Wizzard
Staff member
#29
No one will shut it down here, PnC sucks, they've sucked for 15 years, and I'm pleased to be able to provide a vehicle through which we can chronicle their suckiness. I think Russ Oullette is a star and one of the goodest guys in the industry, and it simply makes me sad that he's associated with a junk company. They treated me like gar bage when I tried to order a pretty expensive pipe many years ago, and I'll never forgive 'em. The recent debacles of shipping, not shipping, selling things they don't have in stock etc till the president of the company had to make a youtube video saying "Gosh, this is all really strange, huh?"... nah I got not enough words for this 2nd rate Walmarty outfit.
 
#30
No one will shut it down here, PnC sucks, they've sucked for 15 years, and I'm pleased to be able to provide a vehicle through which we can chronicle their suckiness. I think Russ Oullette is a star and one of the goodest guys in the industry, and it simply makes me sad that he's associated with a junk company. They treated me like gar bage when I tried to order a pretty expensive pipe many years ago, and I'll never forgive 'em. The recent debacles of shipping, not shipping, selling things they don't have in stock etc till the president of the company had to make a youtube video saying "Gosh, this is all really strange, huh?"... nah I got not enough words for this 2nd rate Walmarty outfit.
Yawn.
 

SmokeRings

Well-known member
Patron
#31
No one will shut it down here, PnC sucks, they've sucked for 15 years, and I'm pleased to be able to provide a vehicle through which we can chronicle their suckiness. I think Russ Oullette is a star and one of the goodest guys in the industry, and it simply makes me sad that he's associated with a junk company. They treated me like gar bage when I tried to order a pretty expensive pipe many years ago, and I'll never forgive 'em. The recent debacles of shipping, not shipping, selling things they don't have in stock etc till the president of the company had to make a youtube video saying "Gosh, this is all really strange, huh?"... nah I got not enough words for this 2nd rate Walmarty outfit.
So uh...you wanna tell us how you really feel? Lol
 

gnossos

the pineapple on your pizza
Patron
#34
Cigars International has sucked since they opened. When they took over PC, they ruined the company. I used to buy tons of tins from them as their prices ordering 5 or more tins of the same blend was cheaper than ordering 20 of the same blend at SP. I spent a ton there and when CI took over they ditched my entire order system with no notice and I lost all my history.
Their inventory went to carp as soon as CI took over. They had no clue what was popular, totally useless buyer.
yeah i’m amused at these threads now

P&C has sucked :ass: for over a decade and not a year goes by without some easily avoidable issue, big or small. So the back and forth and “no i got mine oops i ordered again and finally got burned now i believe you” cycle just keeps spinning.

Don’t buy from P&C. Or do, and take what you get. It’s been a known quantity for eons now.
 

gnossos

the pineapple on your pizza
Patron
#35
No one will shut it down here, PnC sucks, they've sucked for 15 years, and I'm pleased to be able to provide a vehicle through which we can chronicle their suckiness. I think Russ Oullette is a star and one of the goodest guys in the industry, and it simply makes me sad that he's associated with a junk company. They treated me like gar bage when I tried to order a pretty expensive pipe many years ago, and I'll never forgive 'em. The recent debacles of shipping, not shipping, selling things they don't have in stock etc till the president of the company had to make a youtube video saying "Gosh, this is all really strange, huh?"... nah I got not enough words for this 2nd rate Walmarty outfit.
this man knows
 

Sasquatch

Wizzard
Staff member
#38
There's thousands of guys who use PnC almost exclusively, and who have never had a problem. These people speak up on these kinds of threads, I see it on facebook etc, and they speak up loud. So some percentage of PnC's transactions go okay. I feel (without any real evidence, cuz I'm a jerk) that these guys care most about getting 11 pounds of tobacco a month and saving 29 cents doing it. There are lots of these guys around. A similar question could be asked of Walmart - is the retail landscape better off without a place that sells poor quality stuff for low prices. And the user group who goes there will say "No, we NEED shoes for 20 bucks cuz our kids out grow them, we NEED cheap food." etc Which is how these places survive.

My annoyance at PnC is that it's just so wasteful, of time and resources. Hey we shipped you half your order in a giant box, the tins might be a bit banged up, but that's okay, we'll send you replacements when we fill the rest of your order. It's goofy. When I bought a pipe from them, (this is when they were still small), I emailed and asked about international shipping. Was told tersely "just use the website". So I did. And then the headaches started. I selected the single available shipping option, for 19 bucks or whatever, and then they didn't want to send a 300 dollar pipe out without insuring it, and it was gonna cost more, so 3 phone calls and 4 emails later, they managed to mail the thing after I gave 'em another 5 bucks or something, which is what I emailed and asked about in the first place. It was made clear to me that my living in some strange land (Canada mind you, not Moon Base 7) was really a huge pain for them, like... please don't make us do this again. Sir.

So I won't. No problem. My one rule in business is I cannot make you want to do business with me. Goes for lumber, goes for shoes, goes for groceries, and it sure as hell goes for pipes and tobacco. If you don't want to do business with me, I'm happy to oblige you. The consequence is that I'll publically "bash" you for the rest of my life by telling the exact truth about my transactions. I'm not mad at them, I can't say the world would be a better place without them. All I can say is my own experience was pretty poor, and I won't ever touch them again. People who repeatedly buy from them and repeatedly get short shipped or damaged goods.... well, fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me, right?

The landscape has changed a LOT in 20 years here. Laudisi is pushing to be a huge player, not quite a monopoly but they control a lot of stuff, lots of distribution, lots of branding. Good for them, if that's what they want. I don't love every product they sell, but the times I've had a problem with them (wrong pipe shipped one time for example) it was handled with class and no BS at all.

I think it sucks that Jeff at 4noggins is basically AFK. It seems like a few people can access him, but basically if you email 4noggins nothing happens, and it's because they get 9000 emails a day I'm sure. My thought is "okay hire someone to read those" but I don't run that business. (Nor do I get 9000 emails a day, I get about 5 and usually, usually manage to answer them. If I get 6 the wheels come off.)

You guys mostly won't remember Vegas Smokes. Holy suffering Jesus. The originally gong show of the internet pipe world.

So even PnC could be a lot worse than they are. They are bumbling, out of touch, strangely built, and apologistic (with as I say some really good people in certain spots, but just not the spots that matter in this case). But I don't think they are intentionally terrible at this point, I think they are just reluctant to make the changes that would better their service (having already made many changed). That's a money thing and nothing else. You want a custom fitted suit? Don't go to Walmart.
 

Sasquatch

Wizzard
Staff member
#39
I could also write about what I perceive as the uniquely (and unfortunate) American retail experience - what we've all come to accept as normal and necessary here in North America (it's no different in Canada and maybe worst of all right here in Alberta where we've had too much for too long) would be absolutely unacceptable and strange for anyone else in the world.

Buy a pipe from an Italian e-tailer for example. You'll get a confirmation and receipt immediately. You'll get a shipping notice and a tracking number within 24 hours on a weekday. The pipe will show up packaged beautifully, well protected, as though you've bought something of value (you have). It will be gift wrapped. There will be a hand written note from Luca or Pierro or whoever you bought it from. There will most likely be a pack of 100 pipe cleaners, and a coupon or two for your next purchase. Like, it's quite a show. It's important to these guys, they are proud to serve you, they need your purchase to put bread on their table. It's personal.

Can you imagine, as an American, going to buy vegetables, and instead of rooting through 100 mediocre red peppers looking for one that isn't squished or 10 days old, going to the grocer and asking him for a couple, which he would select for you? No, that's weird. Except, that's how it goes everywhere else in the whole world. We're the weird ones. Our gigantic, faceless system.

In "The Tao of Pooh" the author mentions the difference between a Chinese tea-house where people sit for a few hours and talk, and the hamburger stand in America, where the message is basically "Here's your stuff, now gtfo we got more people coming." Culturally a world of difference.